Gazprom ADR 2022 - Wie geht's weiter?

Das im Januar ein neues Gesetz verabschiedet werden soll, darüber hat mich ein Anwalt auch schon informiert.  

so ein Gesetz gibt es nicht und ist auch nicht geplant!

Was durch die Lesung gegangen ist, ist der deklarative Weg mit einem zusätzlichen Zeitfenster!
Es gibt für diesen Weg aber keinerlei Erleichterung, sondern ist quasi 1 zu 1 der gleiche Beantragungsweg wie beim letzten Mal!
Also alles wie gehabt mit Notar, Apostillen, Übersetzungen, Depotbelegen und vor Ort Terminen.

Der reguläre Weg über den ADR Emittenten dürfte verbaut sein. Der Abgleich funktioniert nicht und die Gebührenfreiheit fällt weg.  

Woher hast du deine Info? Kannst du deine Quelle posten?
Ich habe leider nichts im Netz gefunden und kann mich nur auf die Aussage eines Gazprombank Mitarbeiters verlassen.  

wird wohl besser informiert sein  

Das kannst du auf der Seite des russischen Behörden nachlesen.
Der Link wurde sogar im Thread schon zweimal geteilt.
Dort siehst du alle Meilensteine der russischen Gesetze.

Link müsste ich nochmal raussuchen. Auf der anderen Seite wurde es aber wie gesagt schon mehrmals gemacht, und ich habe wenig Lust jedem neuen Hansel alles erneut vorzulegen.

Das geht hier im Thread schon seit Monaten so. Statt sich die Leute richtig informierek, kommen irgendwelche Wunschträume oder Hörensagen-Geschichten.  

https://sozd.duma.gov.ru/bill/222860-8#bh_histras

Artikel 28:
Seite vermutlich nur durch VPN erreichbar. Ist von der russischen Regierung.  

Ich habe es mir fast gedacht, daß du keine Quelle angeben kannst.
Das ist aber kein Grund unfreundlich zu werden.  

Die Quelle ist direkt über deinen Beitrag. Die Homepage der russischen Duma.  

wurde am 19.12  so  Gestz
im Jan 2023 kommt da also nichts mehr oder die machen ein neues Gesetz


Article 28



To make the following changes to the Federal Law of July 14, 2022 No. 319-FZ "On Amendments to Certain Legislative Acts of the Russian Federation" (Collected Legislation of the Russian Federation, 2022, No. 29, Article 5286):

(1) Articles 5(1) to (5) (5) 5 shall be supplemented as follows:



"Article 51



1. If the rights to shares of a Russian joint-stock company, bonds, centralized accounting of rights to which (mandatory centralized storage of which) is carried out by the Russian depository, the investment units of the Russian mutual investment fund (hereinafter referred to as the transferred securities) are accounted for in a foreign organization that has the right to account for and transfer rights to securities, on the account of a person acting in the interests of other persons opened with the Russian depository (hereinafter referred to as Within one hundred and twenty days from the date of entry into force of this article in accordance with the procedure established by the decision of the Board of Directors of the Bank of Russia, the client depository shall be obliged to submit to the Russian depository in which the account of the depot of the foreign nominee holder is opened to account for the rights to the transferred securities, or to the registrar who maintains the register of shareholders of an international company (hereinafter referred to as the Russian registrar of an international company), if the transferred securities are shares of an international company, an order to forcibly transfer the accounting of the rights to the transferred securities indicating the number of securities to be transferred to the account of the client depository. The Government of the Russian Federation, in agreement with the Central Bank of the Russian Federation (Bank of Russia), shall have the right to decide on the extension by not more than ninety days of the period established by this part.

2. From the date of submission of the order on the forced transfer of accounting of rights to the transferred securities, the client depository shall:

1) shall be obliged to send to the foreign organization in which an account of a person acting in the interests of other persons has been opened for accounting for the rights to the transferred securities, a notice of cancellation of all previously submitted and unfulfilled orders for write-off and (or) for crediting the transferred securities;

2) shall not have the right to submit to a foreign organization in which an account of a person acting in the interests of other persons has been opened for accounting for rights to transferred securities, instructions for write-off and (or) for crediting transferred securities.

3. A Russian depository in which a depot account of a foreign nominee holder is opened to account for rights to transferable securities, or a Russian registrar of an international company, if the transferred securities are shares of an international company, on the basis of an order received on the forced transfer of accounting for rights to transferred securities, shall conduct operations aimed at transferring the accounting of rights to transferred securities in the manner and within the terms, which are established by the decision of the Board of Directors of the Bank of Russia.

4. From the date of operations specified in part 3 of this article, the requirements of paragraphs 8 - 11 of Article 85 of the Federal Law of April 22, 1996 No. 39-FZ "On the Securities Market" shall not apply.



Article 52



1. If the rights to shares of a Russian issuer who is an international company are recorded on the personal account of a foreign organization that is a registrar in accordance with its personal law (hereinafter referred to as the foreign registrar) or on the personal account of a foreign nominee holder, the owner of such shares (another person exercising rights under such shares), and if the ownership of such shares is carried out in the interests of another person, Also, a person in whose interests the owner of such shares acts has the right, within one hundred and twenty days from the date of entry into force of this article, in accordance with and in accordance with the provisions of Article 5 of this Federal Law, to submit to the Russian registrar of an international company in which a personal account of a foreign registrar or foreign nominee holder is opened to account for the rights to shares of a Russian issuer, which is an international company, an application for a forced transfer of accounting for the rights to such shares. The Government of the Russian Federation, in agreement with the Central Bank of the Russian Federation (Bank of Russia), shall have the right to decide on the extension by not more than ninety days of the period established by this part.

2. The Russian registrar of an international company shall consider applications for the forced transfer of accounting of rights to shares of a Russian issuer that is an international company, and shall conduct operations to carry out a forced transfer of accounting for rights to shares of a Russian issuer that is an international company no later than ten working days from the date of expiration of the deadline for receiving these applications in accordance with and in accordance with the provisions of Article 5 of this Federal Law, which are established for the Russian depository, in which an account of the depot of a foreign nominee holder is opened to account for the rights to securities of the Russian issuer. The provisions of Article 5 of this Federal Law regulating the activities of a Russian depository in which a depot account of a foreign nominee holder is opened shall apply to the Russian registrar of an international company to the extent that does not contradict the substance of the relevant relations.



Article 53



1. If the rights to the transferred securities are recorded in the account of the owner's depot (the account of the depot of the foreign authorized holder) opened by a foreign organization in the Russian depository, the possession of the transferred securities (the implementation of any legal and actual actions with the transferred securities) shall be carried out by the foreign organization in the interests of another person (hereinafter referred to in this article - the actual owner) on the basis of a concluded (including under foreign law) between by such a person and a foreign organization of the contract, the conduct of operations with the transferred securities is impossible due to the introduction of restrictive measures against the issuer of the transferred securities (the person who issued the transferred securities) and (or) related persons either against the actual owner of restrictive measures or as a result of unfriendly actions of foreign states, international organizations, foreign financial organizations in relation to the Russian Federation, Russian of legal entities and citizens of the Russian Federation, the actual owner has the right, within one hundred and twenty days from the date of entry into force of this article, to submit to the Russian depository in which the account of the owner's depot (the account of the depot of the foreign authorized holder) of the foreign organization is opened, an application for the forced transfer of accounting of the rights to the transferred securities to the account of the depot (personal account) of the actual owner. The Government of the Russian Federation, in agreement with the Central Bank of the Russian Federation (Bank of Russia), shall have the right to decide on the extension by not more than ninety days of the period established by this part.

2. The application for the forced transfer of accounting for the rights to the transferred securities shall contain:

1) information that allows to identify a foreign organization that owns the transferred securities (carries out any legal and actual actions with the transferred securities) in the interests of the actual owner;

2) details of the depot account (personal account) of the actual owner for crediting the transferred securities;

3) information on the number of transferred securities that are in the actual possession of the person who submitted an application for the forced transfer of accounting of rights to the transferred securities as of the date preceding the date of entry into force of this article;

4) assurances of the actual owner to the Russian depository in which the account of the owner's depot (the account of the depot of the foreign authorized holder) of the foreign organization is opened, about the circumstances that are important for the forced transfer of accounting for the rights to the transferred securities, including the accounting of the rights of the actual owner to the transferred securities by the foreign organization, about the actual impossibility in another way (including in the order, to ensure the return by the foreign organization of the transferred securities to the actual owner, the absence of claim rights of third parties in respect of the transferred securities, as well as the absence of encumbrances or restrictions on the disposal of the transferred securities known to the actual owner (with the exception of the restriction of the order established in connection with the unfriendly actions of foreign states, international organizations, foreign financial organizations, including those related to the introduction of restrictive measures against the Russian Federation, Russian legal entities and citizens of the Russian Federation).

3. The application for the compulsory transfer of accounting for the rights to the transferred securities shall be accompanied by documents available in the circumstances and indicating the actual possession by the person who submitted the said application, corresponding to the number of transferred securities as of the date preceding the date of entry into force of this Article, a copy of the contract on the basis of which the foreign entity owns the transferred securities (carries out any legal and actual actions with the transferred securities) in the interests of the actual owner, as well as other documents (if any) confirming the possession of the transferred securities by a foreign organization in the interests of the actual owner (carrying out any legal and actual actions with the transferred securities in the interests of the actual owner), the validity and legitimacy of the applicant's interest.

4. A Russian depositary who has received an application for the forced transfer of accounting of rights to the transferred securities shall not later than three working days from the date of its receipt:

1) make a record on the account of the owner's depot (the depot account of the foreign authorized holder) opened by the foreign organization specified in this application on the establishment of restrictions on the implementation of operations with the transferred securities specified in this application, on behalf of the person to whom such an account is opened;

2) notify the foreign organization specified in the application for the forced transfer of accounting for the rights to the transferred securities of the receipt of this application, the entry of a record of the establishment of a restriction on the implementation of the transaction with the transferred securities and the depot account of the foreign organization under which a record of the establishment of such a restriction is made.

5. The notification of the Russian depositary on the receipt of an application for the forced transfer of accounting for the rights to the transferred securities shall specify:

1) information about the actual owner who submitted an application for the forced transfer of accounting of rights to the transferred securities;

2) information on the transferred securities in respect of which an application has been submitted for the forced transfer of accounting of rights to the transferred securities, including the number of securities transferred;

3) the date on which the compulsory transfer of accounting of rights to the transferred securities will be carried out in the absence of receipt by the Russian depositary of justified objections from the foreign organization.

6. Notification of the Russian depositary on the receipt of an application for the forced transfer of accounting of rights to the transferred securities and objections of a foreign organization provided for in part 7 of this article shall be sent in the manner determined by the depositary agreement concluded between such a Russian depositary and a foreign organization. The date specified in the notification of the Russian depositary, on which the compulsory transfer of accounting of the rights to the transferred securities will be carried out, may not occur earlier than 30 working days from the date of sending the notification by the Russian depositary. In case of receipt of justified objections of a foreign organization in the last two working days of the specified period, this period may be extended by the Russian depositary for the period established by the decision of the Board of Directors of the Bank of Russia.

7. In the absence of reasonable objections of the foreign organization regarding the existence of a contract between the actual owner and the foreign organization, and (or) belonging to the actual owner of the transferred securities specified in the application submitted by it on the forced transfer of accounting of the rights to the transferred securities, and (or) their number, the Russian depository shall conduct operations to forcibly transfer the accounting of rights to the corresponding number of transferred securities Papers. In the event of justified objections of a foreign organization in terms of the number of securities owned by the actual owner, the Russian depository conducts operations to forcibly transfer the accounting of rights only to the number of transferred securities in respect of which there are no objections of the foreign organization. The operation of writing off the transferred securities from the depot account of a foreign organization is carried out without the instruction of the person to whom such a depot account is opened.

8. If there are reasonable doubts about the completeness and (or) reliability of the information specified in the application for the forced transfer of accounting of the rights to the transferred securities and the documents attached to it, or if such information is insufficient, the Russian depository has the right to refuse the applicant to conduct operations on the forced transfer of accounting for the rights to the transferred securities. The applicant is responsible for the accuracy of the information specified in the application for the forced transfer of accounting for the rights to the transferred securities and the documents attached to it.

9. In the event that the total number of transferred securities in respect of which applications have been submitted for the forced transfer of accounting of the rights to the transferred securities exceeds the number of transferred securities accounted for in the account of the owner's depot (the account of the depot of the foreign authorized holder) opened by a foreign organization, operations for the forced transfer of accounting of the rights to the transferred securities shall be carried out in proportion to the number of transferred securities, specified in each application for the forced transfer of accounting of rights to the transferred securities. At the same time, the formation of a fractional part of the transferred security is not allowed. Rounding of the number of securities transferred is carried out to a whole number in the lower direction. The total number of securities transferred is determined separately for each issue of retransmitted securities specified in the relevant applications for the forced transfer of accounting of rights to the transferred securities.

10. In case of refusal to carry out operations on the forced transfer of accounting of rights to transferred securities, the Russian depository shall notify the actual owner thereof no later than three working days from the date of the decision to refuse to conduct operations on the forced transfer of accounting of rights to the transferred securities. The notice of refusal should indicate the grounds on which the Russian depositary decided to refuse to conduct operations to forcibly transfer the accounting of rights to the transferred securities. If such a ground is the receipt by the Russian depositary of justified objections of a foreign organization that owns the transferred securities (carries out any legal and actual actions with the transferred securities) in the interests of the actual owner, a copy of the received justified objections of the foreign organization must be attached to the notification of refusal.

11. A record of the lifting of the restriction provided for in paragraph 1 of part 4 of this Article shall be made by the Russian depositary:

1) simultaneously with making a record of writing off the transferred securities from the account of the depot of a foreign organization in connection with the operation of forced transfer of accounting of rights to transferred securities in accordance with part 7 of this article;

2) on the day of adoption of the decision on the refusal to conduct operations for the forced transfer of accounting for the rights to the transferred securities.

12. If the actual owner does not have information about the Russian depository in which the foreign organization has opened an account of the owner's depot (the account of the depot of the foreign authorized holder) to account for the rights to the transferred securities, the actual owner shall have the right, within the period provided for in part 1 of this article, to submit to the central depository a notification of the rights to the transferred securities, which shall contain information and documents, provided for in parts 2 and 3 of this article. The Central Securities Depository shall hold such a notice for a period of three years. If the actual owner establishes information about the Russian depository in which the foreign organization has opened an account of the owner's depot (the account of the depot of the foreign authorized holder) to account for the rights to the transferred securities, the actual owner who has submitted a notice of rights to the transferred securities to the central depository in accordance with this part shall be entitled within sixty days from the date of expiration of the period provided for in part 1 of this article, submit to the Russian depositary an application for the forced transfer of accounting for the rights to the transferred securities in accordance with the requirements of this Article.



Article 54



1. The management company of an open, exchange-traded or interval mutual investment fund, the assets of which include assets whose actual ability to dispose of which is limited due to unfriendly actions of foreign states, international organizations, foreign financial organizations, including those related to the introduction of restrictive measures against the Russian Federation, Russian legal entities and citizens of the Russian Federation (hereinafter referred to in this If the share of blocked assets is at least 10 percent of the value of the net assets of the blocked fund, it is obliged to make one of the following decisions within the period established by the decision of the Board of Directors of the Bank of Russia:

1) on the allocation of the assets of the blocked fund to an additionally formed closed-end mutual investment fund (hereinafter referred to in this Article - an additional fund);

2) change the type of blocked fund to a closed-end mutual fund.

2. The management company of a blocked fund, in which the share of blocked assets is less than 10 percent of the net asset value of the blocked fund, shall have the right, within the period established by the decision of the Board of Directors of the Bank of Russia, to decide on the allocation of the assets of the blocked fund to the additional fund.

3. If the management company decides to allocate the assets of the blocked fund to the additional fund, the investment units of the additional fund shall be issued to each owner of the investment units of the blocked fund specified in the list of owners of the investment units of the blocked fund drawn up for the issuance of investment units of the additional fund in an amount equal to the number of investment units of the blocked fund owned by the respective owner investment units of the blocked fund on the date of compilation of the specified list, without submitting applications for the issuance of investment units. The issuance of investment units of an additional fund when it is formed to other persons is not allowed. When it is formed, only assets allocated from the blocked fund are transferred to pay for the investment units of the additional fund. The rules for trust management of an additional fund must comply with the requirements established by the decision of the Board of Directors of the Bank of Russia.

4. If the management company decides to change the type of blocked fund to a closed mutual investment fund, the type of blocked fund shall be changed by amending and supplementing the rules for trust management of the blocked fund, which must comply with the requirements established by the decision of the Board of Directors of the Bank of Russia and come into force from the date of disclosure of the notification of registration of these changes and additions on the official website management company in the information and telecommunication network "Internet", and if the investment units of the blocked fund are limited in turnover, then from the date of submission of these changes and additions agreed by the specialized depository of the blocked fund to the Bank of Russia.

5. It shall not be allowed to resume the issuance, exchange and redemption of investment units of a blocked fund, the investment units of which are not limited in turnover, in the event of the formation of an additional fund from the date of sending to the Bank of Russia the rules of trust management of an additional fund and until the day following the day of issuance of investment units of the additional fund, and in case of changing the type of blocked fund to a closed mutual investment fund from the date of sending to registration with the Bank of Russia of amendments and additions to the rules of trust management of the blocked fund and until the date of entry into force of these changes and additions. It is not allowed to resume the issuance, exchange and redemption of investment units of a blocked fund, the investment units of which are limited in circulation, in the event of the formation of an additional fund from the date of sending to the specialized depository of the blocked fund for approval the rules of trust management of the additional fund and until the day following the day of issuance of investment units of the additional fund, and in case of changing the type of blocked fund to a closed unit. investment fund from the date of sending for approval to the specialized depository of the blocked fund amendments and additions to the rules of trust management of the blocked fund and until the date of entry into force of these changes and additions. Investment units of a blocked fund and investment units of an additional fund shall be applied in accordance with the procedure established by paragraph 5 of article 14 of Federal Law No. 156-FZ of 29 November 2001 "On Investment Funds".

6. The management company of the blocked fund shall perform actions (operations) aimed at allocating the assets of the blocked fund to an additional fund, and actions (operations) aimed at changing the type of blocked fund to a closed-end mutual investment fund, in accordance with the requirements established by the decision of the Board of Directors of the Bank of Russia. The person maintaining the register of owners of investment units of a blocked fund and depositories who are nominal holders of investment units of a blocked fund must perform actions (operations) aimed at obtaining by the owners of investment units of a blocked fund investment units of an additional fund, in accordance with the requirements established by the decision of the Board of Directors of the Bank of Russia.

7. By decision of the Board of Directors of the Bank of Russia on the issues provided for in this Article, requirements may be established for the activities of management companies, persons maintaining the register of owners of investment units, and depositories.

8. Decisions of the Board of Directors of the Bank of Russia on the issues provided for in this Article shall be subject to mandatory official publication in accordance with the procedure provided for in part three of Article 7 of Federal Law No. 86-FZ of July 10, 2002 "On the Central Bank of the Russian Federation (Bank of Russia)".

9. The concepts are used in this Article in the senses in which they are used to regulate the relevant relations in the Federal Law of November 29, 2001 No. 156-FZ "On Investment Funds".



Article 55



1. If the owner of the transferred securities is a controlled foreign company, which is recognized as such in accordance with the legislation of the Russian Federation on taxes and fees, whose rights to the transferred securities are recorded in the account of the depot of the foreign nominee holder, the controlling person whose share in the controlled foreign company is 100 percent, or several persons whose share together with the controlling person in the controlled a foreign company in aggregate is 100 percent, entitled within one hundred and twenty days from the date of entry into force of this article, in accordance with and in accordance with the provisions of Article 5 of this Federal Law, submit to the Russian depository in which the account of the depot of the foreign nominee holder is opened to account for the rights of the controlled foreign company to the transferred securities, an application for the forced transfer of accounting for the rights to the transferred securities in the event that, if the conduct of operations with transferred securities in foreign organizations that have the right to account for and transfer rights to securities is impossible due to the introduction of restrictive measures against the issuer of the transferred securities (the person who issued the transferred securities) and (or) related persons or against a controlled foreign company and (or) its controlling person and (or) related persons. The Government of the Russian Federation, in agreement with the Central Bank of the Russian Federation (Bank of Russia), shall have the right to decide on the extension by not more than ninety days of the period established by this part.

2. The application for the compulsory transfer of accounting for the rights to the transferred securities shall be accompanied by documents available in the circumstances and indicating the possession by the controlled foreign company of the appropriate number of transferred securities and the recognition of the applicant as a controlling person, as well as the foreign organization in which the rights of the controlled foreign company to the transferred securities are recorded, all foreign organizations, in which accounts of persons acting in the interests of other persons are opened, in which the rights of a controlled foreign company to transferable securities are taken into account, and on a foreign nominee holder, in a depot account opened with a Russian depository, which takes into account the rights of a controlled foreign company to the transferred securities.

3. The Russian Depositary shall consider applications submitted to it on the forced transfer of accounting for the rights to the transferred securities and shall carry out operations to carry out a forced transfer of the accounting of rights to them no later than 10 working days from the date of expiration of the deadline for accepting such applications in accordance with and in accordance with the provisions of Article 5 of this Federal Law, which are established for the Russian depository, in which a depot account of a foreign nominee holder is opened to account for rights to transferable securities. The Russian Depository carries out a forced transfer of the accounting of the rights to the transferred securities to the account of the depot of the owner(s) opened to the applicant(s).

4. If in a controlled foreign company the share of participation of several persons together with the controlling person is 100 percent, the application for the forced transfer of accounting of the rights to the transferred securities shall be submitted by the controlling person together with all such persons.

5. This article shall apply to controlling persons who have provided a notice of controlled foreign companies for the tax period of 2021 within the established period.";

(2) In Article 6, the words "31 December 2022" shall be replaced by the words "31 December 2023", after the words "paragraph 1 of Article 22" should be supplemented by the words ", paragraph 2 of Article 275-7, paragraph 13 and the first paragraph of paragraph 14 of Article 511".

 

da kommt nichts Neues mehr! Das ist bereits das "neue".

Der User Brongel hat nur Quark erzählt. Aber das ist man in dem Thread hier gewohnt, das ständige Phantasien und Hoffnungen erzählt werden, ohne jegliche Substanz.

Aktuell siehst so aus, dass der reguläre Weg nicht mehr funktionieren wird (Bücher zu und Gebührenfreiheit endet am 31.12.).
Der deklarative Weg wird wieder möglich, aber nur mit den selben organisatorischen Regularien wie zuvor.  

Aus dem Dokument (Ende Seite 4 Anfang Seite 5) kann man entnehmen, daß die für die Zwangskonvertierung nötige Papiere auf eindeutig schlüssige Dokumente reduziert werden.
Eine Art Zwangskonvertierung "light", wie der Sachbearbeiter der Gazprombank es mir auch gesagt hat.

https://sozd.duma.gov.ru/download/3E8D17B8-D61E-4ED0-8ADD-0779BCC2D1E3  

verstehst du ,um was es da geht und ob für uns  überhaupt interessant ?????    

Wenn sich nichts wesentliches verändert wird auch nach der Verabschiedung des neuen Duma Gesetzes die Sache nicht einfacher, wenn man nicht nach Russland will. Durch das 8. Sanktionspaket der EU lehnen sowohl Anwälte als auch Notare jegliche Arbeiten im Zusammenhang mit Russland ab. Die Notarkammern haben in Rundschreiben dies ja an ihre Mitglieder weitergeleitet. Somit bleibt nur die Zusammenarbeit mit russischen Anbietern dieser DL. Beglaubigungen und Apostillen wird es also hier eher nicht geben in absehbarer Zeit. Es gibt wohl in diesem Zusammenhang Austausch zwischen dem Justizministerium und den Kammern, da es um sehr lukrative Geschäfte von Seiten der Anwälte/Notare gerade mit Russen geht. Soll heißen die Hoffnung stirbt zuletzt.

Gruß  

wird wohl kommen steht ja im Gesetz und wurde von GPB MA auch so schon bestätigt

immerhin haben wir nun einen Plan B wenm CS und BNY das nicht hinbekommen zu tauschen

richtig viel Nutzen haben wir aber mit den Aktien auf Typ-C im Moment auch nicht da die Aktien und die Dividende wohl gesperrt sind

da geht wohl um das Prinzip hoffen oder der Tausch mit FF24 wenn die wieder Gazprom ADR anbieten um dann als pseudorusse die Dividende in cash bekommen zu können
 

ich kann die Hoffnung auf Vereinfachung des deklarativen Umtauschprocederes nach einem neuen russischen Recht gut verstehen. Gazprombank und citibank waren von Anfang an nahezu desinteressiert an dem Umtauschanspruch und habe nur wenige "persönliche Abgabetermin" den jeweiligen Anwälten eingeräumt, die sich nur mit "erhöhter Bearbeitungsgebühr" vermehren ließen. Bei der Raiffeisenbank ging es dagegen auch postalisch!
Also völlige Bankenwillkür. Wenn es hier klare Vorgaben ab Januar gibt, dann ist das m.E. grundsätzlich zu begrüßen. Meine Erfahrungen mit den deutschen Behörden, d.h. Notaren war ebenfall von unglaublicher Willkür geprägt. Da Gazprombank erst im Umtauschprozeß meinte auch noch eine Apostillierung der Unterschrift unter die Notarvollmacht haben zu müssen (Wobei bei der Konteneröffung es noch mit einfach beglaubigter Vollmacht ging), benötigte ich diese neue Beglaubigung mit Apostille noch in der letzten Oktoberwoche. Falls alle von ca 8 angefragten Notaren verweigerten ihre Mitarbeit, erst kurz vor knapp habe ich es dann doch noch geschafft.
Also ich komme immer mehr zu der Überzeugung, daß von westlicher, d.h. EU-Seite und bundesdeutscher Seite ein klarer "Enteignungswille" gegenüber Aktionären russischer Unternehmen vorliegt und das natürlich nicht öffentlich so gesagt, aber inoffiziell betrieben wird. Im neuen Jahr sehe ich somit nur noch die Chance für noch nicht konvertierte ADRs-Besitzer, in einer gut vorbereiteten Reise nach Moskau, wobei man dann dort mit Screenshort seines Depots unter notarieller Beurkundung durch einen russischen Notar und entsprechenden amtlich beglaubigten Übersetzungen sein Eigentum rettet. Alles andere, und da muß ich den Skeptikern hier Recht geben, wird bei der Eskalation und der Vordauer des Krieges, keine Chance mehr bieten. Zumindest nicht bis Sommer 2023, wo die letzten Verträge mit den Emmittenten ausgelaufen sind. Meiner Meinung nach lohnt sich der Aufwand ab ca. 40.000 Euro Anlagesumme. Flug, Anwalt, Gebühr für Konvertierung, Depotgebühr bei Gazprombank und Co, Unterkunft, Übersetzungshonorar und spätere jährliche Depotgebühr beziffere ich auf ca. 5-10% der Anlagesumme. Also nachrechnen und abwägen, ob man bei kleinen Summen die Sache einfach abschreibt. Dann wäre zu fragen, ob man einen Verlust steuerlich gegenrechnen kann, sofern man Gewinne mit anderen Wertpapieren generiert hat. Frohe Weihnachten!  

Es kommt darauf an, die wirklich entscheidenden Mitarbeiter der Bank zu kontaktieren, also diejenigen, die wirklich entscheiden... Das scheint aber nur insidern vorbehalten... ein echtes Dilemma.  

es gibt KEINE Erleichterung der Beantragung! Das spinnst du dir nur zusammen.
Aktuell wird's im gesamten durch das nächste Sanktionspaket sogar noch schwieriger.

Der reguläre Weg ist zudem vermutlich tot.  

machen

entweder bny oder gpb ein weg wird gehen

bny kann nicht verkaufen also wird das ewig so bleiben

was aber nun läuft sind die 3? jahre am die dividende nachzufordern  

"es besteht Hoffnung: „Die Duma hat nun ein Gesetz verabschiedet, auf dessen Grundlage ein Umtausch von ADR in Aktien wieder möglich wird“, erläutert WEISSWERT-Anwalt Maximilian Weiss. Das Gesetz dürfte im Januar 2023 in Kraft treten. „Dann tickt die Uhr. Es ist die vermutlich letzte Chance für viele Anleger, ihre Investitionen zu schützen und ADR zu konvertieren“, fährt Maximilian Weiss fort. Zu rechnen sei mit einer gesetzlichen Frist von 120 Tagen, innerhalb derer Investoren Vorkehrungen treffen müssen."  

er macht aber mal wieder  fleissig Werbung für sich...  

Eine nochmalige Verlängerung des deklarativen Wegs wird dann sicherlich nicht nochmal durchgekaut. Das war schon diesmal knapp.
Der reguläre Weg ist wie gesagt vermutlich komplett tot.
Gebührenfreiheit fällt weg, nächstes Sanktionspaket auf dem Weg und zudem gelingt der Abgleich nicht.  

Die Frage ist, wie holt man am meisten raus.
Was richtig ist, weis ich nicht,
ich setze da mal auf den zwangsverkauf durch die Amis.
Macht auf jeden Fall am wenigsten Arbeit  

es gibt keinen Zwangsverkauf wenn der Abgleich nicht gelingt.
Die ADR verbleiben dann in deinem Depot. Du kannst dann abwarten, bis es irgendwann geht oder sie evtl. löschen lassen vom Broker und mit 100% Verlust ausbuchen.  

NSD veröffentlicht Anweisungen zur Freigabe von Vermögenswerten in Clearstream und berät sich mit Euroclear
Freigeben 23.12.22 18:35
Heute, am 23. Dezember 2022, fand eine reguläre Sitzung des Investor Rights Protection Club statt, bei der die Bedingungen für die Freigabe von Kundenvermögen im Rahmen von allgemeinen Lizenzen, die von den Finanzministerien und Belgien an den National Settlement Depository (NSD) vergeben wurden, erörtert wurden.

Wie im Telegram-Kanal des Clubs zum Schutz der Anlegerrechte erwähnt, sprachen die NSD und Rechtsberater über den Inhalt von allgemeinen Lizenzen und Verfahren zur Bereitstellung der notwendigen Dokumente für die Freigabe von Wertpapieren und Fonds von nicht sanktionierten Kunden.

Es wird darauf hingewiesen, dass die NSD in naher Zukunft auf der offiziellen Website Anweisungen für Marktteilnehmer zum Verfahren zur Freigabe von Vermögenswerten in Clearstream unter einer vom luxemburgischen Finanzministerium erteilten Lizenz veröffentlichen wird. Die Interaktion der Teilnehmer mit Clearstream erfolgt über die NSD.

"Nach weiteren Konsultationen mit Euroclear wird die NSD auch eine Kommunikation über das Verfahren zur Freigabe von Vermögenswerten im Rahmen der vom belgischen Finanzministerium erteilten Lizenz organisieren", heißt es in dem Bericht.

Gleichzeitig empfehlen Berater den Clubmitgliedern, weiterhin daran zu arbeiten, individuelle Lizenzen für die Entsperrung von Assets zu erhalten.

https://www.finam.ru/theme/unlocking-foreign-securities/  

Was brauchen wir,
einen Lagerplatz in Russland, bei dem ein,aus, umgebucht werden kann,
mit dem die Banken im Westen zusammen arbeiten dürfen.
Einen großen Spekulanten, der bereit ist gegen Prämie zu kaufen,
wenn der Zusagt 5 Jahre zu halten, dann liegt das auch im Interesse von Russland um die Kurse
für die Russischen Anleger hoch zu halten.
Viele Kleine haben doch die Schnauze voll, und wollen Verkaufen.
Viele Kleine sehen die fallenden Kurse von Rubel und Gazprom, und wollen raus.
Panik Modus, retten was zu retten ist, das ist selten schlau.
Die Russischen Anleger könnten darauf setzen, jetzt zu verkaufen,
und dann günstig von den kleinen im Westen zu kaufen.

Jetzt darauf und auf FF zu setzen, könnte bedeuten, zu niedrigen Kursen und zu hohen kosten zu verkaufen.
Der Zwangsverkauf durch die Amis dürfte zu mindest Kostengünstiger sein.
Und da ich viele die nicht investiert sind, und hier nur ihre Schadenfreude austoben ausgeblendet
habe, können die jetzt ohne zu nerven wieder los legen.